I can not copy MS Combat Flight Sim 2 data disc (CAN YOU?)

[Alora Duncan]

I just installed http://www.simviation.com/files/2cfs/Cfs2nocd.zip
into the Microsoft CFS2 directory; and now I don't need the 2nd
CFS2 disc at all for my kids to run the game.
The wierd thing is that this cfs2nocd program is only 164Kbytes. Can it be
that Microsoft marketing is pulling the wool over our eyes? How can
it be in that 164 kbytes replaces the ENTIRE 2nd disc? Is it that this
second disk is actually nothing but a flimsy excuse to provide two disks
where the second disk does absolutely nothing but allow the installed
software to run? If I was mad at Microsoft for not allowing me to easily
back up my property, I'm even madder now if that MS subterfuge is true.
Why do they waste my time on such sophmoric counter-productive practices?

Does anyone have an answer to this key consumer question above?

Alora

[Jimmy S.]

Hello Alora,

The game is played from your hard drive after you install it.
The CD is only requested to prove you own the original.
That file you've installed only hacks your CFS exe file to prevent
it from verifying that you have the CD. Software thieves use it most.
--
Cheers, Windows XP MVP Shell / User
Jimmy S. http://mvp.support.microsoft.com

Game FAQs: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=FH;[LN];gms
Visit my Zone.com / Gaming Helpsite: http://nibblesnbits.tk or Call / Contact
MS Support at: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=sz;en-us;top
My advice is donated "AS IS" without warranty; nor do I confer any rights.
_________________________________________________________

"Alora Duncan" <***@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:***@posting.google.com...
| > I just installed http://www.simviation.com/files/2cfs/Cfs2nocd.zip
| > into the Microsoft CFS2 directory; and now I don't need the 2nd
| > CFS2 disc at all for my kids to run the game.
| >
| > The wierd thing is that this cfs2nocd program is only 164Kbytes. Can it be
| > that Microsoft marketing is pulling the wool over our eyes? How can
| > it be in that 164 kbytes replaces the ENTIRE 2nd disc? Is it that this
| > second disk is actually nothing but a flimsy excuse to provide two disks
| > where the second disk does absolutely nothing but allow the installed
| > software to run? If I was mad at Microsoft for not allowing me to easily
| > back up my property, I'm even madder now if that MS subterfuge is true.
| > Why do they waste my time on such sophmoric counter-productive practices?
|
| Does anyone have an answer to this key consumer question above?
|
| Alora

[Tuba2]

Post by Jimmy S.
Hello Alora,
The game is played from your hard drive after you install it.
The CD is only requested to prove you own the original.
That file you've installed only hacks your CFS exe file to prevent
it from verifying that you have the CD. Software thieves use it most.
--
Cheers, Windows XP MVP Shell / User
Jimmy S. http://mvp.support.microsoft.com

Well I agree with DOC. I do not have any pirated games but find it a
real pain to hunt up the CD before I can start to fly. Therefore, all
the simulations I can find a "no-cd" or crack for are run that way.
Also I have observed that the offer to replace damaged CD's if the
original was returned to varify you owned it seemed to stop about the
time the protection methods started. Perhaps that is an undisclosed
method of selling more copies of the simulation.
It would work very well for homes with small children or dogs.

Jim

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

Jim;
You can still get replacement CDs from Microsoft on retail product as
long as you are in North America:
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=326246
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
An easier way to read newsgroup messages:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/using/newsgroups/setup.asp
http://dts-l.org/index.html

Post by Tuba2
Well I agree with DOC. I do not have any pirated games but find it a
real pain to hunt up the CD before I can start to fly. Therefore, all
the simulations I can find a "no-cd" or crack for are run that way.
Also I have observed that the offer to replace damaged CD's if the
original was returned to varify you owned it seemed to stop about the
time the protection methods started. Perhaps that is an undisclosed
method of selling more copies of the simulation.
It would work very well for homes with small children or dogs.
Jim

[pjp]

That's bullshit! A number of years ago now I had the last version of Encarta
that still also worked under Windows 3.1 "go bad". Phoning Microsoft was a
waste of my time and money as they 'no longer carried out of date' (quoted
or something very similar) replacement copies. I clearly remember this
happening before 98SE was available so how "out of date" was that? I had
backup cd's of all my software the day after I bought my first burner, swore
that'd never happen again. Never have been able to replace that version of
Encarta though :(

That's one of several reasons I return software if I cannot overcome the
need for the original cd at runtime. I feel nothing's wrong with my taking
whatever measures I can to protect my investment. Clearly being forced to
use the original cd itself is risking that investment (not to mention
incidental wear and tear on my hardware). My preferred method(s) trying to
overcome this "problem" in order of preference are

1) full install and use a "no-cd" crack
2) min install and use a virtual cd (Nero's Imagedrive in my case) with a
"backup cd crack" if neccessary
3) burned backup cd with a "backup cd crack" if neccessary
4) return game to place of purchase and email manufacturer/developer reason
why

My $0.02.

P.S. If MS had been a little clearer about the need for the original cd on
only the first run for Links 2003 I might not have ever bothered dl'ing a
"no-cd" crack. The one-time requirement seems a tolerable (although I fail
to understand why it can't be included in the install itself in that case)
alternative rather than having to use it every time..

Post by Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Jim;
You can still get replacement CDs from Microsoft on retail product as
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=326246

Post by Tuba2
Well I agree with DOC. I do not have any pirated games but find it
a real pain to hunt up the CD before I can start to fly. Therefore,
all the simulations I can find a "no-cd" or crack for are run that
way. Also I have observed that the offer to replace damaged CD's if
the original was returned to varify you owned it seemed to stop
about the time the protection methods started. Perhaps that is an
undisclosed method of selling more copies of the simulation.
It would work very well for homes with small children or dogs.
Jim

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

You start by making an incorrect statement and then babble, much of it
irrelevant.
The fact is I said "You can still get replacement CDs from Microsoft
on retail product as long as you are in North America:
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=326246 "
What is incorrect about that statement?
I never suggested it is available forever, that would be a ridiculous
idea.
Perhaps I should notify those I know that have replaced lost or
damaged CDs that the CDs they received do not exist since you suggest
it can not be done.

You also ask "...how "out of date" was that?"
Well, was there a later version currently available?
How old was it at the time?
Where is it guaranteed in any product, not just computer related,
replacement parts will be available for ever?
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
An easier way to read newsgroup messages:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/using/newsgroups/setup.asp
http://dts-l.org/index.html

Post by pjp
That's bullshit! A number of years ago now I had the last version of Encarta
that still also worked under Windows 3.1 "go bad". Phoning Microsoft was a
waste of my time and money as they 'no longer carried out of date' (quoted
or something very similar) replacement copies. I clearly remember this
happening before 98SE was available so how "out of date" was that? I had
backup cd's of all my software the day after I bought my first

burner, swore

Post by pjp
that'd never happen again. Never have been able to replace that version of
Encarta though :(

Snipped your irrelevant garbage.

[Matthew Shaw]

Oh don't worry, you can just ask Microsoft to publish one brand new disk
from the master copy in a factory just for you - oh and while you're at it,
can you ask them to create me a special copy of "Bilbo's Impossible Machine
Gun Collection"...

Post by pjp
That's bullshit! A number of years ago now I had the last version of Encarta
that still also worked under Windows 3.1 "go bad". Phoning Microsoft was a
waste of my time and money as they 'no longer carried out of date' (quoted
or something very similar) replacement copies. I clearly remember this
happening before 98SE was available so how "out of date" was that? I had
backup cd's of all my software the day after I bought my first burner, swore
that'd never happen again. Never have been able to replace that version of
Encarta though :(
That's one of several reasons I return software if I cannot overcome the
need for the original cd at runtime. I feel nothing's wrong with my taking
whatever measures I can to protect my investment. Clearly being forced to
use the original cd itself is risking that investment (not to mention
incidental wear and tear on my hardware). My preferred method(s) trying to
overcome this "problem" in order of preference are
1) full install and use a "no-cd" crack
2) min install and use a virtual cd (Nero's Imagedrive in my case) with a
"backup cd crack" if neccessary
3) burned backup cd with a "backup cd crack" if neccessary
4) return game to place of purchase and email manufacturer/developer reason
why
My $0.02.
P.S. If MS had been a little clearer about the need for the original cd on
only the first run for Links 2003 I might not have ever bothered dl'ing a
"no-cd" crack. The one-time requirement seems a tolerable (although I fail
to understand why it can't be included in the install itself in that case)
alternative rather than having to use it every time..

Post by Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Jim;
You can still get replacement CDs from Microsoft on retail product as
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=326246

Post by Tuba2
Well I agree with DOC. I do not have any pirated games but find it
a real pain to hunt up the CD before I can start to fly. Therefore,
all the simulations I can find a "no-cd" or crack for are run that
way. Also I have observed that the offer to replace damaged CD's if
the original was returned to varify you owned it seemed to stop
about the time the protection methods started. Perhaps that is an
undisclosed method of selling more copies of the simulation.
It would work very well for homes with small children or dogs.
Jim

[pjp]

Matthew ... I expected to be able to obtain a replacment cd back when it
happened as it didn't seem to be too long a period between the original
purchase and time of replacement request. As I already said, MS not being
able to provide it (along with a SquareSoft game I've never been able to get
to run) has forever changed my attitude towards buying software and what I'm
willing to tolerate given I'm the guy shelling out the money.

Post by Matthew Shaw
Oh don't worry, you can just ask Microsoft to publish one brand new
disk from the master copy in a factory just for you - oh and while
you're at it, can you ask them to create me a special copy of
"Bilbo's Impossible Machine Gun Collection"...

Post by pjp
That's bullshit! A number of years ago now I had the last version of
Encarta that still also worked under Windows 3.1 "go bad". Phoning
Microsoft was a waste of my time and money as they 'no longer
carried out of date' (quoted or something very similar) replacement
copies. I clearly remember this happening before 98SE was available
so how "out of date" was that? I had backup cd's of all my software
the day after I bought my first burner, swore that'd never happen
again. Never have been able to replace that version of Encarta
though :(
That's one of several reasons I return software if I cannot overcome
the need for the original cd at runtime. I feel nothing's wrong with
my taking whatever measures I can to protect my investment. Clearly
being forced to use the original cd itself is risking that
investment (not to mention incidental wear and tear on my hardware).
My preferred method(s) trying to overcome this "problem" in order of
preference are
1) full install and use a "no-cd" crack
2) min install and use a virtual cd (Nero's Imagedrive in my case)
with a "backup cd crack" if neccessary
3) burned backup cd with a "backup cd crack" if neccessary
4) return game to place of purchase and email manufacturer/developer
reason why
My $0.02.
P.S. If MS had been a little clearer about the need for the original
cd on only the first run for Links 2003 I might not have ever
bothered dl'ing a "no-cd" crack. The one-time requirement seems a
tolerable (although I fail to understand why it can't be included in
the install itself in that case) alternative rather than having to
use it every time..

Post by Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Jim;
You can still get replacement CDs from Microsoft on retail product
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=326246

Post by Tuba2
Well I agree with DOC. I do not have any pirated games but find
it a real pain to hunt up the CD before I can start to fly.
Therefore, all the simulations I can find a "no-cd" or crack for
are run that way. Also I have observed that the offer to replace
damaged CD's if the original was returned to varify you owned it
seemed to stop about the time the protection methods started.
Perhaps that is an undisclosed method of selling more copies of
the simulation. It would work very well for homes with small
children or dogs.
Jim

[Angus Lepper]

Um. I agree. You CAN get replacement CDs from Microsoft. I have had them
shipped to me direct from Ireland.

Angus

Post by pjp
Matthew ... I expected to be able to obtain a replacment cd back when it
happened as it didn't seem to be too long a period between the original
purchase and time of replacement request. As I already said, MS not being
able to provide it (along with a SquareSoft game I've never been able to get
to run) has forever changed my attitude towards buying software and what I'm
willing to tolerate given I'm the guy shelling out the money.

Post by Matthew Shaw
Oh don't worry, you can just ask Microsoft to publish one brand new
disk from the master copy in a factory just for you - oh and while
you're at it, can you ask them to create me a special copy of
"Bilbo's Impossible Machine Gun Collection"...

Post by pjp
That's bullshit! A number of years ago now I had the last version of
Encarta that still also worked under Windows 3.1 "go bad". Phoning
Microsoft was a waste of my time and money as they 'no longer
carried out of date' (quoted or something very similar) replacement
copies. I clearly remember this happening before 98SE was available
so how "out of date" was that? I had backup cd's of all my software
the day after I bought my first burner, swore that'd never happen
again. Never have been able to replace that version of Encarta
though :(
That's one of several reasons I return software if I cannot overcome
the need for the original cd at runtime. I feel nothing's wrong with
my taking whatever measures I can to protect my investment. Clearly
being forced to use the original cd itself is risking that
investment (not to mention incidental wear and tear on my hardware).
My preferred method(s) trying to overcome this "problem" in order of
preference are
1) full install and use a "no-cd" crack
2) min install and use a virtual cd (Nero's Imagedrive in my case)
with a "backup cd crack" if neccessary
3) burned backup cd with a "backup cd crack" if neccessary
4) return game to place of purchase and email manufacturer/developer
reason why
My $0.02.
P.S. If MS had been a little clearer about the need for the original
cd on only the first run for Links 2003 I might not have ever
bothered dl'ing a "no-cd" crack. The one-time requirement seems a
tolerable (although I fail to understand why it can't be included in
the install itself in that case) alternative rather than having to
use it every time..

Post by Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Jim;
You can still get replacement CDs from Microsoft on retail product
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=326246

Post by Tuba2
Well I agree with DOC. I do not have any pirated games but find
it a real pain to hunt up the CD before I can start to fly.
Therefore, all the simulations I can find a "no-cd" or crack for
are run that way. Also I have observed that the offer to replace
damaged CD's if the original was returned to varify you owned it
seemed to stop about the time the protection methods started.
Perhaps that is an undisclosed method of selling more copies of
the simulation. It would work very well for homes with small
children or dogs.
Jim

[Frank Hagan]

Post by Jupiter Jones [MVP]
Jim;
You can still get replacement CDs from Microsoft on retail product as
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=326246
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/using/newsgroups/setup.asp
http://dts-l.org/index.html

Post by Tuba2
Well I agree with DOC. I do not have any pirated games but find it

a

Post by Tuba2
real pain to hunt up the CD before I can start to fly. Therefore,

all

Post by Tuba2
the simulations I can find a "no-cd" or crack for are run that way.
Also I have observed that the offer to replace damaged CD's if the
original was returned to varify you owned it seemed to stop about

the

Post by Tuba2
time the protection methods started. Perhaps that is an undisclosed
method of selling more copies of the simulation.
It would work very well for homes with small children or dogs.
Jim

Quote from Microsoft web site:

"Note The current owner must be in possession of the product and be able to
provide proof of purchase of all products when making requests for
replacements through the Supplemental and Replacement parts team."

I've owned CFS, CFS2 and CFS3! They were all purchased and I've got the
original CDs but, "proof of purchase"?? If the game works how many people
save a receipt for two or three years. Come on now raise your hands ;-)
The only one I found was for CFS3. That turkey has been uninstalled.

Just another hoop to jump through so they can sell more games. LOL! I did
find my receipt for Win98SE. It was $180 plus tax and now Microsoft is
dropping support for it! So I had to upgrade to XP. Another $200! I use my
computer for word processing, e-mail and flight sims. Oh yeah, and taxes
once a year ;-) I really needed XP :-(

I still have CFS and CFS2 installed and I have applied the "no CD patch" for
both. My CDs are stored for when I upgrade or replace defective HDs. I won't
buy a flight sim unless there is a "no CD patch" or a full install will run
from the HD! They start faster and run faster from the HD.

Well, there's my rant for today ;-)

FRH

[Alora Duncan]

Post by Jimmy S.
The game is played from your hard drive after you install it.
The CD is only requested to prove you own the original.
That file you've installed only hacks your CFS exe file to prevent
it from verifying that you have the CD. Software thieves use it most.

OK. Well, I own the Combat Flight Simultor (my kids love it).
I paid for it. I own it. I am NOT trying to steal anything.
I want to copy it (because my kids ruin originals in weeks).

Are you saying that that entire second disk is a farce?
It's just a way of Microsoft making sure I paid for my copy?

I can copy the first disk but not the second.
Are you saying there's nothing on the second disk (except the serial number
or something like that)?

Am I safe by only archiving the first disk?

Please explain this to me if you can because it makes no sense to me
for Microsoft to ship an entire CDROM that does almost nothing.
Is the world upside down today? Or is it just me?

[RM]

See Below. Yeah I top-Post, Sue Me!
">

Post by Alora Duncan
OK. Well, I own the Combat Flight Simultor (my kids love it).
I paid for it. I own it. I am NOT trying to steal anything.
I want to copy it (because my kids ruin originals in weeks).

Fully understand that.....

Post by Alora Duncan
Are you saying that that entire second disk is a farce?

No, There are data files installed from their during initial installation.

Post by Alora Duncan
It's just a way of Microsoft making sure I paid for my copy?

Partly. See previous

Post by Alora Duncan
I can copy the first disk but not the second.

I had no problem with CloneCD and Alcohol.

Post by Alora Duncan
Are you saying there's nothing on the second disk (except the serial number
or something like that)?

See Previous

Post by Alora Duncan
Am I safe by only archiving the first disk?

No.

Post by Alora Duncan
Please explain this to me if you can because it makes no sense to me
for Microsoft to ship an entire CDROM that does almost nothing.
Is the world upside down today? Or is it just me?

The world is crap. Everybody is too "sensitive" and Politically Correct.
That is a whole 'nother rant though......

[Jay Williams]

Alora,

All the CDs contain data which are used in the installation of the program.
If you do a full install, all of the game files are written to the hard
drive. This is usually better (particularly in a flight sim) anyway, as it
makes the game run smoother and faster to get the data off the hard drive
then off the (much slower) CDROM.
One of the CDs is copy-protected and is intented to be needed to play the
game. The game isn't pulling data off it, it just has a few lines of code
that check to see if the (original) CD is in the drive. This is how MS
makes sure that only a licensed user is playing the game.
There is a "no-cd" crack available, a link to which has been made available
to you (or I'll email or snail mail a copy to you by CD). This crack either
eliminates the few lines of code or fools it into thinking the CD is in the
drive. It does not replace all the data on the second CD.
Here's what I did. I did a full install. I put the original disks back in
the case and put it in a safe place, away from the grubby little munchkin
fingers. I installed the "no-cd" crack. I play the game without inserting
the CD. Although there is probably a backup program available that would
archive the CD, I didn't bother to find, purchase, or use it. Since the
game was released, I've probably only had to touch the CD four or five
times, so I'm not that worried about the investment.

Post by Alora Duncan

Post by Jimmy S.
The game is played from your hard drive after you install it.
The CD is only requested to prove you own the original.
That file you've installed only hacks your CFS exe file to prevent
it from verifying that you have the CD. Software thieves use it most.

OK. Well, I own the Combat Flight Simultor (my kids love it).
I paid for it. I own it. I am NOT trying to steal anything.
I want to copy it (because my kids ruin originals in weeks).
Are you saying that that entire second disk is a farce?
It's just a way of Microsoft making sure I paid for my copy?
I can copy the first disk but not the second.
Are you saying there's nothing on the second disk (except the serial number
or something like that)?
Am I safe by only archiving the first disk?
Please explain this to me if you can because it makes no sense to me
for Microsoft to ship an entire CDROM that does almost nothing.
Is the world upside down today? Or is it just me?

[DocWW]

I use an application called Alcohol 120%. I made a disk image of my CFS2
play disk and mounted it as a CD drive, Alcohol does the image making as
well as mounting. Using the copy protection emulation function I can now
play CFS2 with out searching for my CD. And yes I do own it. I find mounting
my CD images is a way of saving wear and tear on the disk and very
convenient. I do it for most of my flight sims.

WW